[4Soul]

Ok, so I just saw a thread started by bboy stall I believe which included a long diatribe against this girl and this studio called "Pineapple" who he thinks have no idea what hip hop dance is. Then, a lot of people started arguing, hating and provoking and the thread seemed to die so I thought I would start something new. I have a short (but not simple) question to pose to everyone who reads this. That is:

"What is hip-hop dance?"

I ask this because there is a lot of differing opinions on what constitutes "hip hop dance" depending on who you talk to. A lot of MTV watchers and suburbanites will tell you that it's what Justin Timberlake does in his music videos. A lot of bboys will say that anything done on television isn't real hip hop and only straight battle bboying is hip hop. This results in another question:

"What qualifies as bboying?"

Taking the strict and often forgotten definition, bboying is a style of dance that includes the five sub-styles of toprock, footwork, popping, locking, and power. Many times people seem to forget the funkstyles entirely and erroneously put them into their own categories (ie look at any "bboy" battle where they have separate locking and popping battles.)

If anyone wants to challenge my definition of bboying go ahead. You'll be wrong but you can argue anyway. However, i'd like get back to the main point and discuss the definition of hip hop dance.

To me, when someone says that "bboying isn't hip hop," they are obviously ignorant Bboying (in all of it's aspects) is the only true form of hip hop dance. At the same time, when a bboy tells me that what Chris Brown or Usher does "isn't hip hop" they are to me being just as ignorant. If you look at the definition of bboying it includes five substyles. Now while Usher may not be doing flares in his music videos, you will see him popping and locking. Hell, he even does a hollowback in his "You Remind Me" video. Chris brown does heavy footwork and toprock in all his music videos. Just look at "wall to Wall" and "Kiss Kiss." While it is choreographed, almost every R&B artist is fucking with at least an 8 count of most of the substyles of bboying. Therefore, I will say that they are doing hip hop dance.

Now, I'll say what I think hip hop dance IS NOT. I was raised and currently go to college in Atlanta, GA. For anyone outside of the US who is not familiar with Atlanta, it is the home of Crunk and Trap Music of the likes of Lil' Jon, Soulja Boy, and DJ Unk. In essence, we create the most base and unenlightened forms of hip hop in the world. Ask most people in the ATL what they think hip hop dance is and they'll probably tell you "Walk it Out." This is wrong not because DJ Unk makes Trap Music that most intelligent people despise, but because the movement for "Walk it Out" is a Jazz dance move. It is not within the five substyles of hip hop.

I would like opinions on this. What do you think hip hop dance is? If you disagree with me I want to know why. I only ask that you don't flame. Be constructive about it.

[connor]

Toprock footowork poppin lockin and power ?
arent you missing out freezes?

[4Soul]

freezing is a substyle of power.

[Filley]

Really now...not meaning to offend you or anything, but you are rather arrogant, and freezes being a substyle of power seems incorrect.

[DanceWithTheDevil]

Originally Posted by Filley

Really now...not meaning to offend you or anything, but you are rather arrogant, and freezes being a substyle of power seems incorrect.

QFT. Also, you can't say that those silly club dances aren't hip hop because they are taken from jazz when at the same time you say that the Timberlake stuff is. They are both variations of jazz.

[ExZeLiuR]

B-boying is NOT hip-hop. Absolutely incorrect if someone says it is.

If b-boying IS hip-hop, then b-boying must be the same as MC'ing, graffing, or DJ'ing.
But b-boying is neither the other three.

Therefore,
B-boying is NOT hip-hop.

[cHo¢KoLaTe]

bboying is a style of dance that includes the five sub-styles of toprock, footwork, popping, locking, and power

Lmfao.

[Vice President]

^word, that quote is worth a laugh.

bboying is bboying. you can arbitrarily break it down to as many substyles as you like, but it would be straight up RIDICULOUS to think that the pioneers decided: "hmm... the 5 sub-styles (which isn't even correct terminology because there is no toprock style, it's just TOPROCK) will be tops, fw, power, popping and locking."
popping and locking developed independently of bboying and hip hop, so you're EXTREMELY wrong!!!

just cuz a couple rnb artists steal AND water down some bboying and popping (NOT locking. i have only very rarely seen locking on tv) moves doesn't mean they're doing hip hop dance. go to a hip hop dance class... that's what is considered hip hop dance by most people. it's that overly exaggerated choreography shit.

LOL i'm still laughing at you, bro. sorry, but you're a tool if that is your definition of bboying.

and.. bboying isn't hip hop? it's all semantics. bboying is a part of hip hop, and it IS hip hop if you use "hip hop" as an adjective... not a noun. fuck, grammar lesson.

[PopTrunk]

Originally Posted by ExZeLiuR

B-boying is NOT hip-hop. Absolutely incorrect if someone says it is.

If b-boying IS hip-hop, then b-boying must be the same as MC'ing, graffing, or DJ'ing.
But b-boying is neither the other three.

Therefore,
B-boying is NOT hip-hop.

^^
WTF?

...4soul... who you is?

[Man of Confiden]

Oh. My. God.

I can't believe i actually read thru that entire first post...and i can't believe u actually think ur right. That whole post seemed so arrogant n' everythang...but I will be da next one to tell u that ur wrong. Dead wrong.

First off...neither popping nor locking are a part of bboying. Both had separate pioneers and were separate movements altogether. If you noticed....nobody pops or locks in a bboy vs bboy battle...and thats because their totally different dances. I aint gonna lay out a history lesson...so if you wanna kno wuts up, research both popping and locking separately. Compare that to bboying and tell me wut u get.

Now this contemporary bullshit ur spittin...no chris brown and JT and all those folks aint dancin hip hop. Their mixin a bunch of styles together....jazz steps, rockin steps, poppin...etc. That aint hip hop...its mixed. They're just dancin, aka freestylin.

Anyway, i think u got da message by now. Everybody layed it out pretty clear for ya. Just make sure u have ya facts straight before you use condescendin tones ya kno?? Peace!

[4Soul]

Originally Posted by ExZeLiuR

B-boying is NOT hip-hop. Absolutely incorrect if someone says it is.

If b-boying IS hip-hop, then b-boying must be the same as MC'ing, graffing, or DJ'ing.
But b-boying is neither the other three.

Therefore,
B-boying is NOT hip-hop.

bboying is hop hop dance. it was part of hip hop culture from the beginning. it is the dance of hip hop. I don't see what the problem with this is. when did I ever say it represented the entire culture? it is one facet of it. as for freezing , it's static power versus dynamic power.

[bgirlkatastrophe]

Um...wow. I don't even know where to begin. Clearly I agree with VP. I have a lot more to say to add to it though, apologizing in advance if I repeat anything that was said above while getting my opinion across....I also feel it is neccessary to break down some information that should already be widely known across this forum and am extremely concerned that it is not...

Hip-Hop is a culture, we all know that. It has elements...again I shouldn't have to write this...so instead I will just reference the Universal Zulu Nation Website and post this quote "The Elements: Hip Hop culture is defined as a movement which is expressed through various artistic mediums which we call "elements". The main elements are known as MC'ing (Rapping), DJ'ing, WRITING (Aerosol Art), SEVERAL DANCE FORMS (which include Breaking, Up-Rocking, Popping, and Locking) and the element which holds the rest together: KNOWLEDGE. There are also other elements such as Vocal Percussion/Beat Boxing, Fashion, etc. Within the past 20 years, Hip-Hop culture has greatly influenced the entertainment world with its creative contributions in music, dance, art, poetry, and fashion." done....with that being said....I will continue to move on....

I am directly referencing knowledge that I obtained at Red Bull Beat Riders, and if you want to challenge it feel free to email any of the faculty and they will quickly correct you...The Hip-Hop Choreography Dance Form that so many studios consider Hip-Hop comes from a combination of things, mainly Party Dances (also known as Novelty Dances, or Club Dances) More commonly known nowadays as Soulja Boy, Snap Dances, etc.) These are dances that everyone does the same movements together at the same times and it essentially is choreography. These can also be referenced from back in the day to cabbage patch, running man, humpty dance, and others..again I am just naming things that people are familiar with there are plenty more to reference. These are party dances and they have been going on for a long time as early as the 50's with Doo Wop. You have seen an increase in these party dances in the last few years with Walk it out, Soulja Boy, etc. The music is essentially telling you what to do with your body.

Hip-Hop Choreography is and has been known to utilizie pieces of other dance forms, i.e. bboying, popping, locking, krumping, wacking etc. etc. etc. These are all separate dance forms, but you will see similarities that choreographers use from them in their choreography.

The industry is FLOODED with choreographers who have not trained in these separate styles of dance, but will take certain movements and copy them. But no one is correct in saying that these party dances and fads that have come and gone have not contributed to dance in any way. On another note, you have Fusions that really should not have credibility, i.e. popping and locking and the fools that call it pop-n-lock there is not a dance called pop-n-lock and it is essentially a fusion for those who have no idea of the history of the two completely separate dance forms popping or locking there were a group of people on the west coast that called themselves the poplockers but from what I have been told they were in no way respected and were considered posers...again this is just what I have been told by the founders in my quest for knowledge . .

Along with that, you have more fusions such as the Jazz Dancers that merge together the Hip-Hop Choreography Dance Forms with their Jazz Movements...again this is a fusion and should not be considered Hip-Hop in studios. I am sure the Founders of Jazz Dance would in no way accept it or be happy about it. Just as the Founders of Hip-Hop Dance Forms do not appreciate it either. But it is up to the dancers with the knowledge to inform those in studios who are teaching incorrect knowledge and explain that you do not do Jazz and call it Hip-Hop and you do not teach a course called pop-n-lock.

AND BY NO MEANS does the definition of Bboying include Popping or Locking. Whoever told you that has mislead you in a SERIOUS way!!

Popping and Locking are Funk Styles, you do not Lock to music that you would Bboy to, nor do you Pop to music that you would Lock to. The music should be guiding you to what style of dance you are doing. When you are bboying you should not jump up and start doing wristrolls and Uncle Sams UNLESS the music has changed and your bboy set is over.

I hope this helps, and I am not trying to start a war here, lol I just want to offer up the information that I have learned over the last 10 years or so...

Have a beautiful beautiful day!

Kat

[D.n.A]

HAHAHAHAHAHAshutup

EDIT: directed towards 4soul lol