[J-Hen]

Originally Posted by eddFSC soulja boy made a song that everybody could dance to, worth millions of dollars by combining a simple fruity loops beat with a catchy hook. something from nothing fuuu if that aint hip-hop i dont know what is... another note i still think bams planet rock is kindofa wack song hahaha

Haha, I get what you're saying, but I don't think that's hip hop at all. Sure, he took some stuff that you can get for free, flipped it into this song that has made millions, and now he's a rags to riches guy. The content of the song is nothing near true hip hop in my eyes, and in many others, but to each his own

[AK47]

Thanks for all the props, but I could not have attained this knowledge by myself without harsh criticism from other real heads (those times were tough lol), but I eventually made the conversion from hardcore backpacker to casual hip-hop head. I hope this thread will do the same for you, without the debate because that will just make you want to stand your ground and force you to talk out of your ass.

And whoever said the thing about the rap music without vocals, I think it was ezak, but like I stated before, rap is beats and rhymes. So if you have one part is called rhymes, and the other is called beats. Together, the rap instrumental and rap rhymes, make rap music. I know it sounds corny, but it's the most straight forward approach I can take.

Originally Posted by BboyPlazma u know what i a'int the most famous person on the site but i'm just giving my own opinion he would have never made this thread without at least getting feedback. like i said hip hop is an unwritten code and he can't say what it is because he didn't make it, it's his opinion like i have opinion also. i can see what u mean but i gotta speak my mind especially when i don't agree

Read my entire post over again, like G-RaF said.

Originally Posted by J-Hen Haha, I get what you're saying, but I don't think that's hip hop at all. Sure, he took some stuff that you can get for free, flipped it into this song that has made millions, and now he's a rags to riches guy. The content of the song is nothing near true hip hop in my eyes, and in many others, but to each his own

Read Claim #8

[_-=FiRe=-_]

^Rap can be thought of as Rhythm and Poetry.

[BlankShotz]

You broaden my view thank you. I think everyone now a days doesnt care bout lyrics just something to listen to that sounds good. I like underground and mainstream, its just that the audience chooses what to listen to. Our generation doesn't care bout wise lyrics just a catchy beat.

[k3V1n]

So just clarifying, we are concluding that the majority of our generation's youth is deteriorating in lyrical and complex taste (becomeing stupider in harsher words lol), rather than there being real or fake hip hop? tell me if im not getting it.

[Ezak]

thanks for overlooking my question ak but I think I prefer the term of instrumental hiphop over instrumental rap.

[AK47]

Originally Posted by k3V1n So just clarifying, we are concluding that the majority of our generation's youth is deteriorating in lyrical and complex taste (becomeing stupider in harsher words lol), rather than there being real or fake hip hop? tell me if im not getting it.

I would not say stupider. Ignorant? Possibly. Just because people listen to mainstream music that lacks lyrical complexity does not make them stupid. The pop critic for The New Yorker, Sasha Frere-Jones, is a graduate of Columbia University. Last time I checked, he was praising Lil Wayne's "The Carter III."

Even I like listening to mainstream rap sometimes because some of the producers out there are really amazing. Sometimes I also ask myself, why do I listen to rap music? Is it for casual enjoyment or critical analysis? I suggest all of you ask yourselves the same question. Don't get too caught up in the lyrical content in the song, because it will only leave you confused about which artists you think are "okay" to listen to.

Originally Posted by Ezak thanks for overlooking my question ak but I think I prefer the term of instrumental hiphop over instrumental rap.

Overlook means to "not notice", I think you got it confused. But call it what you want, in the end it's you making the call, and I can only persuade and change your opinion to an extent.

By the way,
NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES! NORWAY RULES!

[JessicaJustus]

Originally Posted by AK47 Even I like listening to mainstream rap sometimes because some of the producers out there are really amazing. Sometimes I also ask myself, why do I listen to rap music? Is it for casual enjoyment or critical analysis? I suggest all of you ask yourselves the same question. Don't get too caught up in the lyrical content in the song, because it will only leave you confused about which artists you think are "okay" to listen to.

SAME, exactly what I am saying

[Murph]

Originally Posted by AK47 Even I like listening to mainstream rap sometimes because some of the producers out there are really amazing. Sometimes I also ask myself, why do I listen to rap music? Is it for casual enjoyment or critical analysis? I suggest all of you ask yourselves the same question. Don't get too caught up in the lyrical content in the song, because it will only leave you confused about which artists you think are "okay" to listen to.

All artists are "okay" to listen to. Regardless of what the artist's angle is, each individual is coming at it with his own style. It may not make itself apparent to you, and even if it does you may hate it. Whats important is you recognize it. Even if that style is wack its still bringing something new to the table. As time goes and the culture and styles expand the up and coming generation is going to progress and evolve it based upon what they have been presented as past examples. If we give less credibility to a certain style as a fact rather than an opinion then as a whole we are hindering its growth. Hip Hop has always been about expression and progression. Although we may not like what the culture is evolving into we must realize that if we dont accept variance and experimentation, we may never see the next level of the culture. If everyone stuck to the traditional Hip Hop ideals then they would grow bored with it. Then the culture would shrink until it disappeared. You just need to know your roots and take your own stance. A lot of people just dont want to be educated. Like I said before, those who get it will get it and those who dont wont. But the latter arent necessarily not contributing anything to the culture. I guess it boils down to the individuals ideals on hip hop. On whether they feel it should be further at risk of its original ideals being polluted or whether they feel the tradition should be carried on by the educated few.

[ktown]

I have to disagree with your second claim. Even Mr. Wiggles, krs-one and other old hip hop heads claim that Emcees and rappers are not the same thing.

I'm not sure if i can classify somebody like lil wayne to krs one. Even Mr. Wiggles himself claims that Emcees and rappers are not the same thing.
I see it, is that hip hop as a genre has branched off. In a sense it is almost like rock, You have Rock and Roll the start of the entire genre, but than it breaks off into punk, metal, alternative, indie, as the list goes on. In a sense The Golden Age of Hip Hop is like the start of the genre. Now all these new rappers coming out are just branches of the main thing.
I know that the golden age wasn't the start of hip hop, but it was when the promotion of hip hop got really big. Rock and Roll wasn't the start of everything either, as it had been taken from rockabilly and other past musical influences. The point is that I don't think that I can consider all these new heads coming up as hip hop artists. Another thing I might add is that to me the emcees of the golden age are like the bands of classic rock. You can't make new classic rock songs. That's why they're called classic. So the way I see it we can't really bring back golden age. Not to say that there is no hope for any future artists. It's just that they won't really be comparable to the golden age, because I would classify them into a different genre. This doesn't mean there cannot be anymore new hip hop heads, because hip hop and rock and roll, or any other main genre is pretty much endless, its just that great artists are harder to come by at this time. Much like bboying these very first bboys we don't compare them to new bboys, because bboying has evolved so much, to do so.

Reminder: What I'm saying is my own opinion none of this is actually official. As far as I'm concerned everything I'm saying may be false this is just how I see it.

[Zync]

You do realize mainstream artists do what they do for the money, correct? They don't think of it as making a point. They're just doing what they are told by their label. It's their JOB.

[NyczFynest]

Originally Posted by eddFSC soulja boy made a song that everybody could dance to, worth millions of dollars by combining a simple fruity loops beat with a catchy hook. something from nothing fuuu if that aint hip-hop i dont know what is... another note i still think bams planet rock is kindofa wack song hahaha

Lmao I don't really like that song either...

But what I wonder is how things will be in the next 20 years...Makes me think if things will change again...maybe people will get lazier on lyrics and just make crazy beats and then all the people that listen to mainstream now will call people like Soulja Boy "underground" and "old-school"...Talk to each other like "Dang this music sucks, what happened to real hip-hop from back in the days like Soulja Boy and Dem Franchise Boys...The people these days have no lyrics!"

[ktown]

I'd also like to add that when you say emcees and rappers are the same thing its more or less saying that bboys and break dancers are the same thing
bboys:break
breakdancers:break
The thing that separates us from breakdancers, is the detail, the individuality, the hip hop, and the history you knw. I feel its the same way it emcees and rappers.

[Env0]

i give Props,
after reading this, my opinions have been changed. I used to be a big, rap is shit, hip hop is where its at. but you pose a VERY VERY good point, by saying that rap is the musical embodiment of hip hop. but we cannot exclude DJ"ing which i feel also is in that musical aspect(but thats my own personal bias and its a bit seperate, and beatboxing, which can be used in Emceeing.

BUt back to the main point of what i was trying to say to what you have done here. you have refounded what we once claimed blasphemy of, as truth. And I respect that. You did it intelligently, and in an incredibly organized manner.

[words of Env0, not someone else on my account]

[Sutley]

Ignore the semantic backwash, AK. You nailed it.